Part 1

Steve: Hi Dave.

Dave: Good afternoon, Steve. Nice to see you. Obviously you're looking for some running shoes today. That's right, and I've come to you because, you know, back when I was running more actively I used to buy my shoes here. You know now I don't run as much as I get older, I guess. I have the feeling it's kind of bad for my knees. Let me get a new profile on yourself Steve.

Okay.

Okay, Number One: When you're running, how many days a week do you like to run? Or how many would you like to run right now?

I'd like to run three or four days a week. Okay.

Now, let me ask you another question: What are we looking at surface-wise? Are you running on the sea wall, are you running on the road? Are you running on the trails?

I take off from my house. I run on the roads for a while, and then you know that trail out towards Eagle Harbor?

I know that trail. It's Sea View Walk. Sea View Walk.

Very rough trail.

Right.

Meaning it's a lime rock. So those lime rocks are very sharp and they punch into the soles of your feet.

Okay.

But it's still softer than the pavement. Oh yeah, very much so. It's very forgiving. But what happens is, they must have laid up some new lime rock. Because once that stuff sets up, it's concrete concrete. But what happens? Okay, go ahead. So you go out to Sea View Walk. Back again.

Typically from around my house, which is around Verdun Park, I run out to the new rec center, and back.

Oh perfect.

That's a nice walk. Sometimes if I'm energetic I'll go to the rec center, lift some weights, and then run home again and jump in the ocean for a swim. That's my tri-athlete experience, then. I've got something really trick to show you, because if that's your concern, regarding the pounding and the route you choose to run on is on the road and then on this pathway. But I should also point out that if I travel, and I travel on business, then I'm hitting pavement right? If I'm traveling to Japan or wherever then I'm normally running on pavement. I'm going to jog my memory and I want to have a look at the shape of your foot. Should I take my sock off?

No, no. That'll be okay. Oh, I see.

Right.

Yeah, okay, just stand for a moment please.

Now, I had an operation to remove a , sort of a calcium growth, there, which I believe was caused by some shoes where there was rubbing on that bone.

Okay, now let me ask you another question. What type of socks do you like to use when you're training? Well your normal gym socks or whatever you want to call them.

Just like this?

Right.

Sort of not heavy and not too light.

Yeah.

Probably a little thicker than this but the same idea.

Why don't we start with this? Should I put these socks on?

Off with your dress socks. Let me have a look at this thing.

See I've had it operated on, right? Who did the operation?

Dr. Thompson was his name. Do you know him? He's at the Lion's Gate. He's one of the better orthopedic surgeons around here, no question about that. He's the new generation. And the old generation?

Oh, it's good. What happens, it's just like anything else, the young kids coming up, they're just on top of everything. And when you compliment it with the old school and the new school everything all works out.

Okay, all right. Put these socks on?

So let's see what happened here. Now I'm going to show you something that I'm excited about presently, but it's going to be sort-of, like, visually difficult for Steve to see. Because when you see the shoe, it's going to look heavy and it's going to look bulky. But, contrary to its performance, it's going to be a very, very pleasant surprise. Okay, good. Yeah.

And also, it's got great durability. So let's see what we can do here. Now if I was to ask you your shoe size, Steve is going to probably tell me nine and a half, ten.

No, no. I would tell you eight and a half, nine.

Okay.

I would say nine, and I know that because my skate size is eight and a half.

Okay.

Two of my toughest customers are soccer players and hockey players. If the toes aren't bleeding and the feet aren't just squashed in like a vice. Now what happens is I know you said that my hockey skates, my ski boots? What happens: those shoe sizes carry over into your everyday situation. Let's see what happens. I'm also going to cheat with the shoe that I'm going to show you. I'm going to add what we call a spankle insole to the shoe. So what happens, if there's any doubt about the cushioning and everything, that's going to be all gone. Yeah, cushioning is important.

If we're lucky, you're going to be able to run at least easily three days a week, whatever you want. So the shoe I'm going to show you has all the characteristics of a top-end shoe. So I'm going to hand you?See how light that is? Now, what happens, don't place it on yet. What gives us a shoe, even though it looks bulky and it looks like a hiking type of shoe, there's a big height difference between area of impact and the toe loft. So when you're starting moving in the shoe, it just really enhances the rotation of the foot. Now, one thing nice about this shoe is that this actually has a little plate under here, a polyurethane plate. Now what happens is when you hit the Sea View Walk Trail, you don't feel any of those stone. All right, good.

Also, I don't know whether you do any hiking or not. Well I went up to Grouse Grind the other day, so that qualifies.

Oh yeah. This is a fabulous shoe, a fabulous shoe. You know all those sharp boulders and all those log-type stairs? You're not going to feel the stuff punching you in your foot. You're not going to. All right, I can see the one problem I'm going to have with you is the size and the shape of your foot. So let's go straight to the problem foot. Now it is a bit wider. That's a good size! Just stand, please.

Okay.

Move your heel to the back of the shoe, please. Hold your head up please, shoulders up please. The reason? is that the end of your toe right there?

Yep.

Okay.

The reason why? Just sit down please. I asked you to hold your head up, mainly because it's 40% of your body weight. My head?

Yeah.

My head is forty percent of my body weight?

No. I goofed there.

But the head is very heavy.

I'm going to quickly answer this and I'll be right with you. Go ahead.

Hello. Hi. I'm sitting here with Dave Wong and he's showing me some shoes, and we're basically recording it. But that's good, we have an interruption. It makes it all very realistic.

No it's not a problem. Go ahead.

I don't think at this point. I mean we add it when we can, we don't need to now. Okay.

Thanks. Bye.

Okay, the situation here, what I'm looking for, is I'm looking for a thumb's width in front of the toes. That's more than I normally would have thought. Well, a matter of fact, I knew I was going to have problems with you on this. And that is your longer foot, too, I think.

Is that right?

Now check this out. This is called a spankle insole.

Right.

Now what that is, it's put into shoes or it's an add-on into the shoes. And it gives the shoes about 15% more cushion.

Okay.

Okay.

Let me back up here, when we were speaking about the head. When you bend over to check what I'm doing, and what I'm doing is I'm searching where the end of your toe is. Your taking a significant amount of weight off your feet.

Okay.

Or you're transferring it, so I don't really get a true reading. Okay.

So what happens, is I remove the foot bed from the shoe. Then I take the spankle insole and I put it on the? I goofed there.

You goofed. You got the wrong size spankle insole? Anyway?

You know, the thing is that some of these things I do blindly, automatically, without checking. And boy, did I ever goof up on this one. Not a problem. We'll redo the size, and we'll see what happens here. So you were on the Grouse Grind.

Well, I went up with Mark, you know, I haven't been there for a couple of years so I thought I'd give it a try. The thing is, going up with a young beefcake like that, did he thunder up?

Well, I'm not trying to follow him up, he went up in whatever it was, thirty-nine minutes. I did forty-five.

I'm going to tell you, thirty-nine and forty-five are very, very impressive. At thirty-nine, and plus forty-five, the flies are not hanging around you. You're moving. Nobody passed me, let's put it that way. You're moving. Well, that's right. And I did it a couple of years ago at forty-two. I mean I did forty-two on it, so I think I can do forty-five.

Can I ask you to stand again here?

These look like really good shoes for the Grouse Grind.

Wiggle your toes gently , please. Gently. That's your toe right there? Yep.

Okay, just sit down please. What I'm doing, Steve, I'm looking for the end of your toe. Right.

Now it's mandatory that I fit the longer foot all the time. And I want to get a thumb's width in front of the toes. Now that's etched in stone. Okay.

The thumb's width. Yeah.

The thumb's width is etched in stone. We know that.

All right. So this Vast, now, is this a new company? Because I'm familiar with Asics and Nike. Okay, what this is, this is a mountain boot company who have gone into mountain running shoes. So but what happens, this shoe has performed so well that I peddle it. I also present it as a running shoe.

Right.

But what happens is I get individuals like yourself, who use the shoes for a lot of things.

Different uses. Yep.

So, but what happens, we're going to? Just stand please. That's the end of your toe right there? Yep.

Just sit down. So we're going to maximize the use of this shoe. But what happens, in all reality, we will not be compromising regarding performance. You may not use this in a marathon.

Well, I'm not running any races anyway. See the longest I'll ever run is thirty-five, forty minutes. I'm not going to run any marathons. Thirty-five, forty minutes is a nice little? But if you crank out forty-five minutes on the Grouse Grind, that's very, very impressive. Yeah.

It doesn't bother me. Plus, in a way it's better because I'm not pounding, kind of going vertical. That's right. So, the young man must be getting himself hockey fit.

Well, he's working to get himself in shape for? He might go one more year. He's been going to Japan to play hockey for the last three years. And, of course his oldest girl is going to start school so the family won't go there with him. So I think he'd like to play a lot longer but family-wise, not so easy. Well, at least he's enjoyed a dream. That's exactly right. But I was quite impressed that your kids are doing some interesting things, too.

Well, they're okay, you know. They're more grunts. Well, I mean, your daughter is into IT-type stuff and living in Paris, and trilingual and your boy is a reporter for Canadian press. I mean, that's pretty interesting. Should I stand up on it?

No, no, I just want to check. Just stand, please.

Move your heel to the back, gently, gently. Hold your head up, just put some weight on the feet. We're right there. Sit down. I've always viewed myself as a very good eye for sizing. I thought to myself, "Oh, I'm going to have trouble with Steve from his hockey." Every time I see a hockey player, I just cringe. I think, "Ahh!" It's a continuous battle. Because they want them smaller.

Well, the thing is: A lot of the guys here play hockey. They always wear everything tight, and it's given them good results. So, would wearing running shoes on a snug format give them good results?

Right.

So I have that to deal with. So I'm looking for comfort. And I look at your foot, I thought, "Oh, you're a long, long time hockey player and person." I thought, "I wonder how I'm going to handle this." So, I'm trying to figure out how to break this news to you. Oh, I'll go with whatever. Size ten.

Size ten! Are you serious?

Size ten!!!! You may have to require some medication or therapy. Whatever comes first.

Size ten! No wonder I get bone growth on my foot.

Oh, yeah. I've got to tell you something, pal. There's just no way that Steve Kaufmann should be wearing a nine or an eight and a half. I looked at you. Thank God you're wearing sandals.